This is from yesterday but the impact this clip had on my is still there tonight so that's why I'm posting this. The clip title says so much 'we saw things that will forever be hard to unsee'. I could see in the face of Johnathan Miller, frustration, disbelief and total horror to what he is witnessing at this moment in time. (Just think about that for a minute... Really think)
The clip of his story is heart wrenching and makes me sick that this world, our world is allowing this to happen. And it's not just in Gaza. It's a time for change in our world and the way we all live together on our planet.
There should be NO WAR!
It's time for everyone on this planet to help each other and care for each. Each one of us is an important individual here. The is not one person on this planet the doesn't matter!
There are ideas out there we can change things... This is only one of them, the road map to non-violence
The last night was extreme. The “ground invasion” of Gaza resulted in scores and carloads with maimed, torn apart, bleeding, shivering, dying – all sorts of injured Palestinians, all ages, all civilians, all innocent.
The heroes in the ambulances and in all of Gaza’s hospitals are working 12-24 hour shifts, grey from fatigue and inhuman workloads (without payment all in Shifa for the last 4 months), they care, triage, try to understand the incomprehensible chaos of bodies, sizes, limbs, walking, not walking, breathing, not breathing, bleeding, not bleeding humans. HUMANS!
Now, once more treated like animals by “the most moral army in the world” (sic!).
My respect for the wounded is endless, in their contained determination in the midst of pain, agony and shock; my admiration for the staff and volunteers is endless, my closeness to the Palestinian “sumud” gives me strength, although in glimpses I just want to scream, hold someone tight, cry, smell the skin and hair of the warm child, covered in blood, protect ourselves in an endless embrace – but we cannot afford that, nor can they.
Ashy grey faces – Oh NO! Not one more load of tens of maimed and bleeding, we still have lakes of blood on the floor in the ER, piles of dripping, blood-soaked bandages to clear out – oh – the cleaners, everywhere, swiftly shovelling the blood and discarded tissues, hair, clothes,cannulas – the leftovers from death – all taken away … to be prepared again, to be repeated all over. More then 100 cases came to Shifa in the last 24 hrs. Enough for a large well trained hospital with everything, but here – almost nothing: no electricity, water, disposables, drugs, OR-tables, instruments, monitors – all rusted and as if taken from museums of yesterday’s hospitals. But they do not complain, these heroes. They get on with it, like warriors, head on, enormously resolute.
And as I write these words to you, alone, on a bed, my tears flow, the warm but useless tears of pain and grief, of anger and fear. This is not happening!
An then, just now, the orchestra of the Israeli war-machine starts its gruesome symphony again, just now: salvos of artillery from the navy boats just down on the shores, the roaring F16, the sickening drones (Arabic ‘Zennanis’, the hummers), and the cluttering Apaches. So much made in and paid by the US.
Mr. Obama – do you have a heart?
I invite you – spend one night – just one night – with us in Shifa. Disguised as a cleaner, maybe.
I am convinced, 100%, it would change history.
Nobody with a heart AND power could ever walk away from a night in Shifa without being determined to end the slaughter of the Palestinian people.
But the heartless and merciless have done their calculations and planned another “dahyia” onslaught on Gaza.
The rivers of blood will keep running the coming night. I can hear they have tuned their instruments of death.
Please. Do what you can. This, THIS cannot continue.
Mads Gilbert MD PhD
Professor and Clinical Head
Clinic of Emergency Medicine
University Hospital of North Norway
Independent Co Uk
"We know to well that our freedom is incomplete without the freedom of the Palestinians"
And the freedom of every living being on this planet.....
I dream of a peaceful, compassionate and, non-violent world.
I wonder am I crazy and dream too much?
About 5,000 demonstrators against Israel’s military strikes in Gaza held a protest yesterday in the Chilean capital, home to a sizeable Palestinian community.
The march took demonstrators to the Israeli embassy in Santiago, where some participants glued pictures of children who have died in the attacks to the walls of the building.
The marchers continued on to the embassy of the US, seen as Israel’s close ally.
Source and full story on
Thousands took part in the protest in Paris, despite it being banned. Some threw stones and bottles at riot police, who responded with tear gas.
Source and story on
Thousands of protesters gathered in London today to call for an end to Israeli military action in Gaza and 'justice and freedom' for Palestine.
Up to 15,000 people marched through the capital from Downing Street to the Israeli embassy in Kensington.
Respect MP George Galloway addressed the crowd. He said: 'They want to end the Palestinian people, but the Palestinians will never surrender.
'We are here to stay. As long as one Palestinian remains alive we will be with them.'
Source and story on
Crowds gathered at Auckland's Aotea Square to protest the Israeli ground invasion of Gaza have been urged to shut down the Israeli embassy in New Zealand.
Groups including Global Peace and Justice Auckland, the Palestine Human Rights Campaign, Kia Ora Gaza, the Mana Movement, and the Unite union participated in the demonstration.
Crowd estimates varied from a few hundred to more than 1500.
Green MP Kennedy Graham told protesters their purpose was to promote peace. "And there can be no peace without justice," Graham added.
Source and story on
Pro-Palestinian group Boycott, Divestment and Sactions (BDS) will hold a protest against Israel’s offensive on Gaza outside the Israeli embassy’s trade office in Sandton, Johannesburg on Friday.
Source and story on
Dear National Security Agency (NSA),
You are collecting date on basically every person on the internet. I have heard many people say "I don't mind, I have nothing to hide". Well I don't have anything to hide but I DO mind! Leave me alone!
If I'm not "doing anything wrong" then WHY are you watching me?
Every time I see Edward Snowden I am more impressed than the time before! This interview is no exception.
Thank you Edward!
Here is the transcript as I assume this link will not work for very long.
0:00exclusive interview with average no NBC next0:07tonight0:07Edward Snowden's first interview on american television0:11former NSA director has said you have done0:14significant an irreversible damage the man who stole an essay secrets talks0:20about what drove him to do0:22sometimes to do the right thing you have to work and how we ended up in0:26exile inrush people gonna find it hard to believe0:29that president clinton hasn't taken run0:32you what you know tonight the man who insists he is a trained spy0:37I'm not gonna be scrambling gents to get a 29-year-old0:40packer and is wanted for espionage while insisting he's a patriot0:45you hear often in the United States why doesn't he come home face the music0:50from NBC News inside the mine up Edwards no1:00good evening i'm brian williams he is routinely called the most wanted man in1:05the world than last week in Moscow1:07cloaked in secrecy and after months of behind-the-scenes back and forth1:12we sat down with that word snowden for his first American television interview1:17let's begin with the reminder of what this 30-year-old has done and why he's1:21living in exile overseas1:24wanted for espionage in this country the classified documents he stole1:29downloaded from the NSA and handed over to journalists1:33blew the lead of data mining programs1:36that had been launched in the wake up n in the name of 9/111:40they have names like prism and boundless informant and X ke score1:45some other designed a vacuum up phone and internet data from companies like1:50horizon and Google and Apple on Yahoo and some of them have directed could1:55zero in on1:56any one of us snowden came to this interview clearly armed with talking2:01points ready to tell a story2:03he knew he would be receiving no compensation and no question was2:07off-limits2:08already just today based on pre-release snippets of what you're about to see2:12Secretary of State John Kerry launched a fall on frontal assault on Snowdon2:17calling him a traitor challenging him to come home to face justice2:21and in just a moment we'll hear what Edward Snowden has to say about that2:25he arrived alone2:29carrying only a backpack into our moscow hotel2:32he avoided the lobby came up a back stairway and into the elevator2:36and the moment he sat down in our camera focused in on him2:40it became clear that this was the first good long look at him the world has had2:45we'd seen em framed against that hotel window when hong kong is appearing be a2:50closed-circuit video from undisclosed locations2:54see but he was here now introducing himself2:57as and a lot of people would say you off badly damaged your country3:01I'd say can you show them is there any demonstration because I've been asking3:05the United States the press has been asking the United States government3:08for a year now if after year they can show a single individual who's been3:14harmed in3:15anyway by this reporting is it really so grave3:19is really so serious and can we really trust those claims without scrutinizing3:23I'd argue that we can't a but we should be open to it it's fair3:27the possibility exists and here this is causing serious harm3:31I personally would like to know about former NSA director Keith Alexander has3:36said3:36you have done quote significant3:39an irreversible damage to the nation he said there is quote concrete proof the3:44terrorist groups and others are taking action3:47and making changes and it's going to make our job3:51tougher and this amounts to telling our enemy3:54our playbook so what's interesting is that we see the exact same language4:00the exact same accusations being4:04leveled against whistleblowers being labeled against any credit coming up on4:08the program4:08%uh throughout history throughout time what are you doing in Russia4:12might so this this is a really fair concern are I4:15personally I'm surprised that I ended up here4:19arm the reality is I never intended to end up in Russia4:23I had a flight booked to cuba onwards to Latin America4:26I had ice stopped because the United States government decided to revoke my4:31passport4:32and trapped me and a Moscow Airport4:35I so when people ask me why are you in russia4:39I say please ask the State Department the US State Department says Snowden's4:46passport was polled be four he boarded that flight to Moscow and yet he was4:51somehow still able to leave Hong Kong4:54a city he had chosen to fly to initially upon leaving the US4:58a formerly high-ranking American official said to me5:03if Snowden's equivalent Russian kid was5:07in our hands in the United States we would be working mightily5:11to AB friend him and5:14absent that infiltrate what he hands what he knows5:20what has your relationship ban to the host5:24nation have you met putting have you spoken with pull5:27right so I have no relationship with Russian governmental I'm5:31I've never met the russian President arm5:35I'm not supported by the russian government taking money from the russian5:38government I'm not a spot5:39which is the real question the best way5:43to make sure that for example the russians can break my fingers and5:47and compromise information or or hit me with a bag of money until I give them5:50something5:51was not to have it all and the way to do that was by destroying material that I5:56was holding before5:57I transit to russia people gonna find it hard to believe6:01that president clinton hasn't taken run agnew6:04or what you know you can state6:07declaratively but that hasn't happened yeah6:10I mean the the Wii6:15the way we need to think about this is6:18again I ready now how to deal with counterintelligence beyond that6:22I took nothing to Russia so I could give them nothing6:26you say you're not carrying around any of these materials you have6:29handed them off if I gave you a laptop6:33could you access the documents6:38now know you could remotely electronically access materialists6:42it's gone from your control try I don't have any6:46control let's put it this way if I'm traveling6:50to Russia and I know I'm traveling through russian I know they've got a6:53very aggressive very professional service6:57and I look like tweety bird to solicit cat if I look like a little walking7:02chicken leg with all these documents7:04life I got control over that that's a very dangerous thing for me7:09we'll take our first break here and up next when we continue the impact of 9/117:14on Edwards no in 2004 I joined7:18US Army I was injured very early on in the program marcia7:23going back almost a year to when this story first broke Edwards Snowden was7:27defined early on and not altogether accurately7:32the president famously called him a hacker we in the news media passed along7:37and repeated terms like7:39Systems Analyst an outside contractor7:42that didn't really mean all that much and according to Snowdon7:46didn't really describe what he did for a living7:50how do you define yourself7:54are you were you trained as a spy7:58specifically I'm talking about this the titles8:02a systems analyst contractor8:05it seems to me spies probably look a lot more like and Snowden a lot less like8:10James Bond these days8:12well it's no secret that the US tends to get more and better intelligence8:17out of computers nowadays than they do out of people8:21harm I was trained as a spy and sort of the traditional sense of the word in8:25that8:25I lived and worked undercover overseas8:28pretending to work in a job that I'm not and even being assigned a name that was8:33not mine8:34now the government 1990s things they might frame it in certain ways and say8:38all you know he's a he's a low-level analyst8:41but what they're trying to do is they're trying to use8:44one position than I've had in a career here where their8:48to distract from the totality my experience which is that8:51I've worked for the central intelligence agency undercover8:54overseas I've worked for the national security8:58agents being undercover overseas and I'm work for the defense9:02intelligence agency has a lecture at the joint counterintelligence training9:05academy9:06where I developed sources and methods for keeping our information people9:10secure9:11in the most hostile and dangerous environments around the world9:14so when they Sam a low-level Systems Administrator that I don't know what I'm9:18talking about9:19I'd say it's somewhat misleading snowdon says his life changed9:23back when he was still a teenager on the worst day in modern American history9:29what did 9/11 mean to you9:32I've never told buddy this on journalist9:35but I was on Fort me9:38on September 11th I was right outside the NSA9:42so I remember I remember the tension on that day9:47I remember hearing on the radio the plaintiff and I remember9:51thinking my grandfather who work for the FBI time9:55was in the pentagon when the plane hit10:00I take the thrifts terrorism seriously I10:03and I think we all do and I think it's really disingenuous for10:07for the government to in folk hi10:10and sort of scandal eyes are memories to sort exploit10:14to the national trauma that we all suffer together10:18and worked so hard to come through to justify programs10:24that have never been shown to keep us safe10:27but cost us liberties10:30and freedoms that we don't need to give up in our Constitution says we should10:35not give up10:35then there is this way of looking at it10:39our nation had been attacked in this10:43nonlinear way10:46we were hurting post Pearl Harbor10:49herding why not10:53cast the widest net possible10:56innocent people around the country were10:59all felt the same way I've got nothing to hide we've gotta find11:04this enemy week can see the definition of a security stay11:09is any nation that prioritizes security11:13over all other considerations I don't believe the United States is11:19forever should be a security state if we want to be free11:23we can become subject to surveillance we can't play11:28giveaway power privacy we can't give away11:32our rights11:34we have to be an active party we have to be an active part of our government11:39and we have to say here11:42there are some things worth dying for11:45and I think the country's one like a lot of young11:48man in our country and especially given the fact that11:53your grandfather was at the FBI your dad's a vet11:58like a lot of the young man across America are you wanted to join a12:03and you did in 2004 I joined12:06the US Army under the 18 X Rick Special Forces Group program12:10now are I have to give high respect12:14to to everyone in the military and especially graduates or those programs12:17because they are better man than I12:19are I was injured very early on in the program and washed up12:23and you know I I readily admit I I don't like that so snowden reportedly left the12:28military after breaking12:30both of his legs in training but the fact is that I tried12:33you know I I saw what was going on in the world12:37I believed the government's arguments that we were going to do good things12:41in Iraq that we were going to free the oppressed and I wanted to do my part12:46to help share the National Park and create not just a better America but a12:50better world the problem was12:54as as time went on as I12:57Brize Bros to higher and higher levels and intelligence communities I gained13:02more and more access13:03as I saw more more class find information at the highest levels13:07I'm I realize that so many of the things that we're told by the government simply13:13aren't true13:13much like the argument about aluminum tubes and Western that mass destruction13:18in Iraq13:19colin powell's speech with the violet anthrax that saddam was going to13:23to bring against us %ah the Iraq war13:28that I signed up for was launched on false premises13:32the american people were misled now whether that was13:36too bad faith or simple mistake some intelligence13:40I can't say for sure but I can say it shows the problem13:45%uh putting too much faith in intelligence systems13:49without debating them in public when we have since will take another break here13:54coming up how Edwards snowdon says the NSAA can reach into our lives13:59via our phone just turned it on it can be there14:02they can turn into a microphone they can take pictures from14:06welcome back in the name of 9/1114:10the government was now able if they wanted to use our computers to reach14:15into american lives in American homes14:18unbeknownst to the citizens of this country overtime14:22Edwards know who says he started thinking it was a perversion of the war14:26on terrorism14:27whatever you think of them what Edward Snowden told us about spying on our data14:33and our personal devices14:35was chilling and as an example we use the phone14:39in my hand i want to ask about this device14:43this is not my iPhone this is14:47what drug dealers resort to this is called a burner14:50it's a temporary it's the 1i brought to14:54cover the Olympics because our IT people told me14:58that the russians are so good15:01at infiltration how good15:05and how good are the americans what can the NSA15:09do with this device if they wanted to get into my life15:14so first off that's probably be a the most expensive15:18burner I've ever seen her but I guess work the15:21upmarket I'm using tomorrow drug dealer job15:25this is the kind of say inert15:29right the the the NSA the russian intelligence service the Chinese15:34intelligence service15:35any intelligence service in the world that has significant funding15:39and a real technological research 10 can15:42only that phone the minute it connects15:45to their network as soon as you turn it on it can be theirs15:49they can turn into a microphone they can take pictures from in15:52they can take the date of it but it's important to understand that15:57these things are typically done on a targeted basis16:02right it's only done when people go this phone16:05is suspicious I think it's being held by a drug dealer I think it's being used by16:09a terrorist16:11can anyone turn it on remotely efforts of can they turn on APs16:16did anyone know or care that I googled16:19the final score of the Rangers Canadiens game last night because I was traveling16:24here16:24I would say I yes to all those they can absolutely time on what did with the16:28power turned off to the Vice16:30that's pretty scary but the thing about the Rangers game is also scare you might16:34say16:36does anybody really cater that i'm looking up the score for the Rangers16:39game16:40well government or hacker or some other16:44nefarious individual would say yes they're very interested in that16:49because that tells a lot about you per soccer tells you probably speak English16:54it says you're probably in american I your interested in this sport16:58and they might know what your habits17:02are where were you when the world when you checked the score to check in when17:06you travel on to check in when you're just at home17:08%ah they'd be able to tell something called your pattern of life17:11when are you doing this kind activities when do you wake up when do you go to17:15sleep17:16what other phones are around you when you wake up and go to sleep are you with17:19someone who's not your wife17:21are you doing something are you someplace you shouldn't be17:24according to the government which is arbitrary and how are17:27are you engaged in any kind of activities that we disapprove of17:32even if they aren't technically illegal and all these things can raise your17:36level of scrutiny17:37even if it seems entirely innocent to you even if you have nothing to hide17:41even if you doing nothing wrong17:44these activities can be misconstrued misinterpreted17:47and used to harm you as an individual even without the government having any17:51intent17:52to do you wrong the problem is that the capabilities themselves17:56are unregulated uncontrolled and dangerous18:00all because I don't hold Rangers Canadiens final score18:04exactly snowdon says he was astonished back then at the access he had his18:09fingertips18:11most notably including a computer program that18:14as he put it could get inside your thought process18:18the stack when I think about an instance that18:22that really just struck me it's oh my god18:26we can do this and that we can do it18:29anyone was there people in an essay analysts18:33can actually watch people's internet Communications watch them18:38draft correspondents and actually watch their farts18:42form as they type as %um right a message18:46you know and analyst at the NSA or any other service out there18:49that using this kind of attack against people can actually see18:54you right senses and the backspace over your mistakes men change the words and18:58I'm18:58kind of pause and and think about what you wanted to say19:02and then change it and it's this extraordinary intrusion19:07not just into your communications you're finished messages19:10for your actual trafficking process into the way you think19:14you must have been aware spying is sometimes called a dirty business19:18lives have been taken on unsavory deeds have been committed19:22the you know I don't think anybody who19:28who's been in the intelligence community for almost a decade as I've been19:31hi is really shocked19:36by the specific types half general operations19:40when they're justified19:43what's more shocking for anybody is not the dirtiness19:47the business it's the dirtiness up the19:50targeting is the dirty mess up the way these things are being used19:55it's the for lack of respect for the public19:59because and the20:03the lack of respect for the intrusiveness20:06parts arrangements when the president and others have made the point that you20:10should have gone20:11through channels become a whistleblower20:15am NOT pursued the route you did what's your response20:19I actually did go through channels20:23and that these documents the NSA has records they have copies of emails right20:28now20:28to their office and general counsel to their20:31oversight and compliance folks from me raising concerns20:36about the NSA's interpretations amendments legal authorities20:39now I embrace these complaints Manchester officially20:43in writing your email I to these officers and and these individuals20:47but to my supervisors to my colleagues in more than one office I did for me20:53I did in Hawaii and many many of these individuals were shocked by these20:58programs they never seem21:00themselves and the ones who had went21:03you know you're right these are things that are really concerning in21:07these are things that we should be doing maybe we're going too far here but21:11if you say something about this21:15they're going to destroy you do you know what happens to people who stand up and21:19talk about this21:20what did you report what was the response so I reported21:24and that there were up all real problems21:28with the way the NSA was interpreting its legal authorities21:31and the response more or less I and bureaucratic language was21:35you should stop asking questions and these are these a recent records this is21:41an ancient history one of my eye I would say wanna my final official acts and21:45government was continuing one of these are21:47want these communications with the legal office and21:51in fact I'm so sure that these communications exist but I call on21:55Congress to write a letter to the NSA21:57to to verify that they do right to the Office of General Counsel22:01and say did mister sloan hi22:04ever communicate any concerns about the NSA's interpretation its legal22:10authorities22:10now about that last point there about the paper trail that snowdon says exists22:16within the NSA so far NBC News has learned from multiple sources that22:21snowden22:22did indeed send at least one email to the General Counsel's office22:26raising policy and legal questions we have filed a request under the Freedom22:31of Information Act to look for any22:34other records and when we continue here tonight22:37the question are the secrets of the US military safe22:41I'm a human being I could make mistakes I can make the wrong call22:49and welcome back as we enter our second half hour as we continue to hear from22:52Edward snowden part of a wide-ranging conversation taped a week ago in moscow22:58we have already heard some extraordinary things but as you'll see he's not done23:03yet I'm doing this to serve my country23:05I'm still working for the government being a pantry means23:09knowing when to protect your country23:13if I could go anywhere in the world that place would be home23:19have what's known as last posting was in Hawaii23:22there he rented a house where he lived with his girlfriend and performed23:25electronic surveillance for the NSA23:28it was said he took his last position to gain access to the final documents23:33he wanted to steal and then leak how long prior to23:38leaving Hawaii did you start to say to yourself23:42I'm gonna gather this I'm gonna put this away I'm going to expose this23:48I think given the ongoing investigation23:52that something better not to get into in a news interview23:56but I'd be happy to discuss these things government what is the number what's the24:00closest you've come to estimating the number24:02love documents I will say the 1.7 million documents figure that the24:08intelligence community24:09has been bandying about are the director of an ass a himself24:14Keith Alexander said just a week ago and the Australian Financial Times24:17Australian Financial Review I believe I24:21didn't they have no idea what documents were taken at all24:26there are turning was so poor so negligent24:30that any private contractor not even a unemployed the government could walk24:34into the NSA building24:35take whatever they want and walk out with it24:39and they would never know now I think that's a problem and i think thats24:43something that needs to be resolved people need to be held to account for24:46has it happened before could it happen again what24:50didn't you grab was there a threshold24:53right I didn't want to take information24:57bed would I basically be25:00taken and thrown out in the press that will cause harm to individuals that25:04would have cost people25:05guy that would put lives at risk so a good gauge25:10path what information was provided to the journalists25:14is a representation what you see in the press25:17now if the NSA and25:20Defense Intelligence Agency and some of these other organizations have claimed25:24that lives are at risk but all this military information was out there that25:28arm you know i i took all this information about missiles and warheads25:32and tanks25:34but we don't see it in the newspaper me know we we we haven't seen any stories25:38on their25:39snowden turned over the secret documents to Glenn Greenwald a lawyer turned25:44journalist25:45and Laura Poitras a documentary filmmaker both at home traveled to25:49Russia for our interview25:51in his recently published book no place to hide25:54greenwald describes that moment he first met snowden in hong kong25:59what did you make love him the26:02initial impression was on the extreme confusion because I have is expecting to26:07meet somebody in his 60's or 70's someone very senior26:10in the agency because I knew almost nothing about him prior to our arrival26:14on hong kong26:15it was a a really intimidating moment you know it was a26:22it was the most real point26:26of no return because the minute you start talking to a journalist26:31as an intelligence officer I on camera26:35I there's really no going back from that that's a26:39that's where it all comes together also you had this tangible evidence26:43in effect he was saying to you if I wasn't legit where else would I have26:47gotten26:48this rate i mean that that was certainly Inc to a good start to establishing his26:53credibility and his authenticity was the fact that he was able to produce many26:57thousands are above documents from the most secretive agency of the world's27:00most powerful government but at the same time there are questions about27:04the authenticity of those documents the Providence27:07a the motives that led to his taking them27:10and what it was that he would say when he when he identified himself to the27:14world as27:14as the source by handing over the documents to journalists snowdon says he27:19wanted to put some space between himself and what he himself stole from27:24government computers27:25he wanted others to break the stories and do the reporting and check to see27:30which stories might cause undue harm27:33and that's the reason that the journalists have been required by27:36their agreement with me as the source although they could obviously27:40a break down to do whatever they want but I demanded27:43that they agree to consult with the government to make sure that no27:47individuals are specific arms could be caused by any of that reporting27:50that includes NBC News which has reported on its own batch of Snowdon27:55documents and has a reporting relationship with Glenn Greenwald27:59when it comes to specific stories about the %uh specific collection programs28:03about specific targets28:04these are decided by me these are decided by newspapers TV you see the28:09part of this and28:09and for a lay audience looking on28:13they know that this came from me you28:17the the balk release to the journalists28:20came from you they are guessing that you and decisions to make within what you28:27and access to28:29so then they hear you saying I didn't put that out28:32the journalistic right now that's a fair question28:36you know any anyone can second guess my judgment and you know again I'm a human28:39being28:40I could make mistakes I could make the wrong call but the reality is28:44the situation determined that this needed to be told28:47to the public to your knowledge there is nothing in what you've handed over to28:51the journalist28:53materially damaging or threatening to the military or national security28:59and and there's there's nothing that would be published that wouldn't that29:02harm29:03the public interest fees are programs that need to be understood29:07that need to be known that require deep background and the context for research29:11there29:12difficult to report but they're critical public importance29:16time just for clarification here note that snowden didn't denied turning over29:20military secrets29:22he asserted instead that they wouldn't be published29:25another break when we continue how snowden justifies29:29what he did there've been times throughout American history29:34where what is right29:36is not the same as what is legal29:39sometimes to do the right thing you have to break the wall29:44on the range between ticker tape parade and life sentence29:47what do you think ought to happen to you if and when you return to the United29:51States29:52these are things that no individual should empower themselves29:56tough to really decide I you know I'm going to give myself a parade30:01com30:03the but neither am I going to walk into a jail cell %uh30:06to serve as a bad example for other people in government Cosi30:12something happen some violation of the Constitution I think they need to say30:15something about30:16you hear often in the United States why doesn't he come allman face the music30:20it's a fair question you know why doesn't key I30:23why doesn't he I face charges30:27but it's also uninformed because30:31what has been laying against me are not normal charges30:34their extraordinary charges a we've30:38seem more charges under the Espionage Act30:41came the last administration we have in all other administrations and30:45I am in American history the Espionage Act30:49provides hi anyone accused amid but no chance to make30:53a public defense you are not allowed to argue30:57based on all the evidence in your favor because that evidence may be classified31:01even if it's exculpatory31:03and so when people say I why don't you go home and face the music I say31:07you have to understand that the music31:10is not and open court and a fair trial31:13what would you do if you had an audience with the president31:18right now what would you say I would leave31:23I advising the president to his advisers that so31:30I wouldn't presume to to to place myself number31:34the level tend to be able to suggest what his course of action should be31:38would you ask him if you come home free and clear31:44I think that's a decision that heal when I31:47and and decide based on what he believes would serve the public interest and I31:51think that's proper appropriate in your mind though31:54are you blameless at have you done as you look at31:59as you look at this just in good thing32:02have you performed as you see it a public service32:06I think it can be both32:10I think the most important idea is to remember that there have been times32:14throughout American history32:15where what is right32:18is not the same as what is legal sometimes to do the right thing you have32:23to break the law32:24and the key there is in terms of civil disobedience32:28you have to make sure that watch risking32:31what you're bringing on to yourself does not serve as a detriment32:35anyone out it doesn't hurt anybody else and if you're volunteering yourself32:40to be used as a negative example for volunteering to spend a lifetime in32:43prison32:43rather than to send spend a time in prison32:47a short period where your comment you advocate you'll emerge stronger32:51and be able to inspire other people to resist these policies32:55are you doing good or you doing bad legal sources tell NBC News that33:00Snowden's legal team has been in contact with the government's lawyers but33:05negotiations have not yet begun33:07are you looking for clemency or amnesty would you like to go home33:11I don't think there's ever been any question that I'd like to go home I'm a33:15knife33:16from day one said the I'm doing this to serve my country33:19I'm still working for the government now whether the amnesty or clemency ever33:24becomes a possibility is not for me to say33:26that's a debate for public and the government to decide but33:29if I could go anywhere in the world that place would be home and when we continue33:35an american in russia Edward snowden talks about what his life33:39is like now in exile and how he feels about coming home33:44I think it's important to remember33:47that people don't set their lives of33:51fire and in and burned down everything they want33:55for no worries33:59this is some a big cultural change34:03you in effect move to Russia from Hole WY34:07what is your life like you know it's summer34:10it is a a major cultural gap and it requires adjustment but34:15even I didn't choose to be here even though you know34:18circumstances really trapped me here34:21%ah I can adapt I can34:25lives life as an american more or less that's the beauty of the Internet34:29is that we're no longer tied to our communities34:32merely by you know while a physical connection side34:36right now I'm watching a show the wire or perhaps some friends process for34:41I'm really enjoy and second seasons October but34:44what do you make of the fact that president Putin's standing in the world34:48let's say34:49has changed so dramatically34:53during that time you have been here it is34:56it's really frustrating are34:59for someone who is working so hard35:04to expand the domain Cartwright's in our Privacy35:07to end up35:11stuck in a place where those rights are35:14are being challenged hi35:17in ways that I would consider deeply unfair there but the recent35:21bloggers registration law in Russia I I can't think I've any basis for a lot35:25like that35:26not just in russia but in any country the government shouldn't be regulating35:30the operations a free press whether it's35:33NBC or whether it's some blogger in their living room35:37there's so much that needs to be defended here in Russia35:40but I'm limited by my inability to speak Russian and so on and so forth35:44that its it's an isolating and frustrating thing and I really hope35:48debt I Russia the United States and many other countries35:53will work to push back against this35:57constantly increasing surveillance against this constant erosion and36:01abrasion36:01of public rights test crack me if i'm wrong. the archive your life is36:06you went from signing up for the military after 9/1136:09in effect saying you are willing to die for your country36:12to then telling people you half expected36:16to die via abduction her assassination after36:20what you've done in this instance that a36:23pretty dramatic arc sense 2003-200436:28I think that's actually a up36:33a solid representation of the dramatic arcs36:37debt have happened within our government and the same period do you think our36:41nation has changed since September 1136:43have our policies change has the manner of our government change has36:47civil in gage mint with the government changed36:50%ah have our politics changed our things and people36:53radically different in terms of partisanship under Ben radical changes36:57within our government36:58do you see yourself as a patriot I do37:03you know i i think patriot is a word it's37:07thats thrown around so much that it can be devalued37:12nowadays but being a patriot doesn't mean37:15prioritizing service to government above all else37:19being a patriot means37:23knowing when to protect your country37:26knowing when to protect your constitution knowing when to protect37:31your countrymen37:33from the violations have been and encroachments37:37up adversaries and those adversaries don't have to be37:40foreign countries they can be bad policies37:44they can be officials who you know need a little bit more accountability37:48they can be mistakes of government and and simple overreaching things that that37:53should never been tried or or that went wrong37:55did you say earlier you were still serving your government yes37:59how so when you look at the actions that I've taken38:03when you look at the carefulness of the programs that have been this close when38:07you look at the way38:08this has all been filtered to the most trusted journalistic institutions in38:12america38:13when you look at the way the government has had a chance to chime in on this38:17and to make their case and when you look at the changes that it's resulted in38:24we've had the first open federal court38:27ever review these programs declare likely unconstitutional38:31and orwellian and now you see congress agreeing38:35that massive surveillance ball collection38:38needs to and with38:41all these things happening that the government agrees38:45all the way up to the president again %ah make us stronger38:50how can it be said that I did not serve my government how can be said that this38:55harm to the country38:56when all three branches of government have made reforms as a result but39:01but many in government say snowden should pay for what he has done39:05whether or not he comes home what do you miss about home39:09a I think the only39:13the only I answer to something like that for some reason my situations39:18you know what don't I miss what would you guess39:21you know what what you miss I miss my family39:25I miss my home I miss my colleagues39:29%ah I miss the work because39:32caught up in all these issues people have39:35you know unfairly demonized and I say to all a point that's too extreme39:39these are good people trying to do39:42hard work for good reasons39:47the problem hi that we're confronted with39:50that the challenge that we are facing39:53is not the working level guy is you now some are some39:57mustache twirling villain was out to destroy your life40:00it's the fact that senior officials are investing themselves with powers40:07but they're not entitled to and they're doing it without asking the public for40:11any kind of concert is what I just heard you feeling bad for them40:15damage to the NSA as a result40:18love what youve exposed from the NSA but what you need to understand in him40:24what I was saying I I guess not what you need to understand but40:28what I'm saying is not40:32damage to the NSA its40:36the sort of conspiratorial thinking they can merge sometimes when we see the40:40Government has committed40:41real and serious abuses that lead us to think they can do no good40:46and the government does have legitimate programs and legitimate purposes in the40:50kingdom great thanks40:51be an essay can as well I think it's important to remember40:55that people don't set their lives on fire41:00they don't say goodbye to their families actually pack up without saying goodbye41:03to their families41:04%ah they don't walk away from their41:08make extraordinary extraordinarily comfortable lives I mean I'm a lotta41:12money for a guy with a high school diploma41:14com41:17and and and burned down everything they love for no reason41:22so you're a kid from North Carolina and while high after this interview I'm free41:26to fly back to the United States41:28new can't does that hurt you41:35I think nobody could no american Kirton41:38be prohibited from coming home Earnhardt traveling anywhere else41:42are without feeling since a loss but again41:48hi may have lost my ability to travel41:51but I've gained the ability to go to sleep at night41:54to put my head on the pillow I feel comfortable that I've done the right41:57thing41:58even when it was the hard thing42:01and I'm comfortable with that a good number of americans of course feel that42:06because of what they see as an active trees and they sleep less42:11soundly at night sharing this massive leak of Secrets has endangered the42:16country42:16and there is more on the way Glenn Greenwald says the next story he is42:21going to publish based on the Snowdon documents42:24maybe the biggest yet in terms of impact that is our broadcast for tonight we42:29want to let you know we're gonna keep going here in the studio to ask the42:32question impart to take on this same question42:35is snowed no hero or a traitor we have assembled our correspondents and former42:40government officials to analyze what he just had to say42:44and play some material from snowden that we have not yet aired42:48it will all happen on our website NBC news dot com42:52please join us there join the conversation it will start now and run42:56for the next hour and long after tonight's broadcast42:59it will remain posted on the web as a companion to what we've just seen43:03tonight
Please lets all stand and protect our human rights! Each and every one of us on this planet have rights. Lets defend and preserve them!